[OMC-Boats] Reply to Ted Robinson

Hey Ted you are lucky you are not in the hospital after saying things like
that to a wife armed with a paddle! I would take that carb to a mechanic -
maybe a seat or jet in the primary bowl is defective. It will be a simple
fix once you find the problem. TK
----- Original Message -----
From: <omc-boats-request@...>
To: <omc-boats@...>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 9:58 PM
Subject: OMC-Boats Digest, Vol 26, Issue 43

> Send OMC-Boats mailing list submissions to
> omc-boats@...
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> omc-boats-request@...
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> omc-boats-owner@...
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of OMC-Boats digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Sticking Carb Float (Ted Robinson)
> 2. Re: Sticking Carb Float (bchowk@...)
> 3. Re: 1ST RUN CHECKLIST (Ethan Brodsky)
> 4. Re: Sticking Carb Float (Lee Shuster (lib1))
> 5. [OMC-Boats]
> http://go.mrgasket.com/newproducts/CAT_PDF/InboardFuelSystem.PDF
> (Lee Shuster (lib1))
> 6. Re: 1ST RUN CHECKLIST (Andy Perakes)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:34:19 -0700
> From: "Ted Robinson" <tederobinson@...>
> Subject: [OMC-Boats] Sticking Carb Float
> To: <omc-boats@...>
> Message-ID: <AE09BB7F30BE4396A4B08988A5D35534@...>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> 1970 Seasport wth HUFR19E 155 V-6 (kaiser)
> During the pressure check part of conducting some preventive maint by
> changing the two inline fuel filters, one at the transom and one above the
> fuel tank at the inlet side of the electric fuel pump added by the prior
> owner, I noticed fuel pouring out of the top of the carb.
> Rather than trying to figure out why the float was sticking,I decided to
> just rebuild the carb.
> I purchased a kit locally @... auto parts and took the carb apart. It was
> surprisingly clean and the metal float appeared to be as it should, no
> cracks or indications of leakage.
> I did not boil the carb, just blew the passages out with compressed air
> put in the new parts, set level/drop & put her back together.
> Added a fuel press gauge @... the inlet to carb so I felt like I had a better
> picture for future troubleshooting.
> When tested before & after the final mounting of the carb the press was
> right @... 6psi and no leaky.
> Today she ran great for the first 5 tenth of an hour, then the RPM seemed
> to have a mind of its own.
> Popped the bonnet and there was fuel pouring out of the top of the carb
> again. Shut her down and very nicely asked my wife to paddle us back to
> the dock. Her response is not important here.
> I seem to have an intermittent sticking float. I do not see any reason to
> re kit the carb, but some of you may have an idea or know of a quirk in
> this carb system.
> New carbs are spendy. Can I use a local auto parts for the carb, or am
> stuck with marine only?
> Thanks in advance
> Ted Robinson
> Terrebonne,Oregon
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/private/omc-boats/attachments/20090615/8d1d44a1/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 23:48:07 +0000
> From: bchowk@...
> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] Sticking Carb Float
> To: "Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's"
> <omc-boats@...>
> Message-ID:
> <2038412321-1245109591-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2118568594-@...>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain
>
> You really need to stick to the marine carb for safety sake and depending
> on where you are you may run afoul of the law with an auto carb.
>
> B.C.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Ted Robinson" <tederobinson@...>
>
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:34:19
> To: <omc-boats@...>
> Subject: [OMC-Boats] Sticking Carb Float
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OMC-Boats mailing list
> OMC-Boats@...
> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 19:53:12 -0500 (CDT)
> From: Ethan Brodsky <brodskye@...>
> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] 1ST RUN CHECKLIST
> To: Lee Shuster <lee.k.shuster@...>
> Cc: omc-boats@...
> Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58.0906151935190.29912@...>
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
>
> On Mon, 15 Jun 2009, Lee Shuster wrote:
>> When I arrive at the lake, and I'm in the launch line here's my
>> procedure:
>>...
>
> That does sound very thorough and effective at preventing problems (though
> I seriously question the wisdom of turning the drive over *at all* without
> having water going to the pump), but I've been using a much simpler
> procedure for ~5 years with pretty good success. I have the 155 hp V-6
> and
> it has an internal automatic choke built into the carb (though I am pretty
> sure it isn't working, as the line is disconnected). Here is my
> procedure:
> - make sure drain plug is in
> - launch boat with outdrive partially raised, tie to pier
> - turn on blower for a minute or two
> - usually peek under the engine compartment lid for water or fuel
> - lower outdrive entirely
> - turn key to run, give (electric) fuel pump a few seconds to build up
> pressure (can tell because the sound changes)
> - pull throttle all the way back to idle, keep drive in neutral
> - set throttle a tiny bit off idle (maybe 1/2" or so)
> - crank until it fires, usually within 3-4 s
> - if it won't start, pump throttle once or twice while cranking
> (usually only necessary with air temperatures close to freezing)
> - if it starts and stalls immediately, give it a bit more throttle and
> try again
> - once it does start, let it high idle (~1000-1500 rpm) for 30 s
> to a minute while everyone gets on
> - pull fully back to idle (600-700 rpm)
> - push "reverse" button and back away from the pier
> - "taxi" out to "no wake" buoy 200 ft from shore at or just off idle -
> (2-3 minutes)
> - smoothly but quickly advance throttle to full, then pull back to ~3/4
> throttle a few seconds later, once the boat is on plane
>
> I know it's bad to heavily load a cold engine, but I'm not convinced that
> warming up at idle is much better. For a modern engine, the best thing
> you
> can do is to warm them up rapidly at moderate power - I'm guessing that's
> less true for these 40 year old designs, but for cold-starts at
> above-freezing temperatures, there should be little harm in immediate
> application of moderate power. Even with older engines, warmup at idle
> can
> actually be detrimental, as they tend to run very rich when cold, washing
> away the oil film on the cylinder walls. I doubt there's any harm for
> the lengths of time and above-freezing temperatures we're talking about
> here, but it's something to consider.
>
> Ethan
>
>
> --
> Ethan Brodsky
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 19:20:19 -0600
> From: "Lee Shuster (lib1)" <lib1@...>
> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] Sticking Carb Float
> To: "Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's"
> <omc-boats@...>
> Message-ID: <43BCD9F2-6893-4FD0-9DDD-E733FE26E453@...>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed";
> DelSp="yes"
>
>
> You can find several MARINE sources for this carb under the following
> reference numbers:
>
> Rochester Products Model Number: 2GC
> Rochester Products # 7026180
> OMC Carb # 772831
> OMC Usage: 155 hp from 1967 - 1972
>
> I believe Sierra still have them as well as others including Mallory
> Marine.
>
> Look at it this way -- price of the carb, will be less than a fire!
>
> Lee Shuster
>
> On Jun 15, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Ted Robinson wrote:
>
>> 1970 Seasport wth HUFR19E 155 V-6 (kaiser)
>> During the pressure check part of conducting some preventive maint
>> by changing the two inline fuel filters, one at the transom and one
>> above the fuel tank at the inlet side of the electric fuel pump
>> added by the prior owner, I noticed fuel pouring out of the top of
>> the carb.
>> Rather than trying to figure out why the float was sticking,I
>> decided to just rebuild the carb.
>> I purchased a kit locally @... auto parts and took the carb apart. It
>> was surprisingly clean and the metal float appeared to be as it
>> should, no cracks or indications of leakage.
>> I did not boil the carb, just blew the passages out with compressed
>> air put in the new parts, set level/drop & put her back together.
>> Added a fuel press gauge @... the inlet to carb so I felt like I had a
>> better picture for future troubleshooting.
>> When tested before & after the final mounting of the carb the press
>> was right @... 6psi and no leaky.
>> Today she ran great for the first 5 tenth of an hour, then the RPM
>> seemed to have a mind of its own.
>> Popped the bonnet and there was fuel pouring out of the top of the
>> carb again. Shut her down and very nicely asked my wife to paddle us
>> back to the dock. Her response is not important here.
>> I seem to have an intermittent sticking float. I do not see any
>> reason to re kit the carb, but some of you may have an idea or know
>> of a quirk in this carb system.
>> New carbs are spendy. Can I use a local auto parts for the carb, or
>> am stuck with marine only?
>> Thanks in advance
>> Ted Robinson
>> Terrebonne,Oregon
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OMC-Boats mailing list
>> OMC-Boats@...
>> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/private/omc-boats/attachments/20090615/58206d76/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 19:27:34 -0600
> From: "Lee Shuster (lib1)" <lib1@...>
> Subject: [OMC-Boats]
> http://go.mrgasket.com/newproducts/CAT_PDF/InboardFuelSystem.PDF
> To: "Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's"
> <omc-boats@...>
> Message-ID: <ACEE17B2-AB3A-4A4C-958B-BC47B45B8C6C@...>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"
>
>
> http://go.mrgasket.com/newproducts/CAT_PDF/InboardFuelSystem.PDF
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/private/omc-boats/attachments/20090615/5c4d85a7/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:59:00 -0400
> From: "Andy Perakes" <aperakes@...>
> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] 1ST RUN CHECKLIST
> To: "Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's"
> <omc-boats@...>
> Message-ID: <F441EF422CB945B89EFDBD50ADA8F62C@...>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Yes, Lee, the "little red sliding lever" is exactly what I'm referring to.
> I figured for a 1st run checklist it was easier to just refer to it as a
> choke, but you are absolutely correct that it does not function as a true
> choke. Thanks for clarifying that to all who might appreciate more than
> my
> short-cut terminology!
>
> On backing down the ramp, its good to be cautions about fully dropping the
> drive unless you are absolutely sure of conditions at the launch ramp. I
> launch in a very shallow creek with a poorly maintained, busted-up
> concrete
> ramp. For me to back in with the unit down would generally mean packing
> the
> drive deep into mud or busting the prop or drive on a concrete block
> inconveniently relocated by some bored teen. These props and drives are
> at
> such a premium that I've been to known to paddle the entire 1/2-mile out
> to
> the lake if conditions are bad enough. Even if I think it's deep enough
> to
> run (with the unit just barely in the water), I still drag a paddle over
> the
> side to feel for depth, logs, rocks, etc. Likewise, I always raise the
> unit
> before pulling out, though I drop it again to drain after I'm clear of the
> ramp (then raise it again ~1/2-way to travel). I also raise my speed-o
> tube
> for the same reasons. The funny part is when I warn "newbies" about
> conditions in the creek and they think their fancy jet drives are immune;
> eventually I'm sure to see them deep in the muck trying to pull the crud
> out
> of their plugged impellors.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lee Shuster" <lee.k.shuster@...>
> To: "'Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's'"
> <omc-boats@...>
> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 6:30 PM
> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] 1ST RUN CHECKLIST
>
>
>> Andy,
>>
>> That's a great description of your time proven procedure. Thank you for
>> pointing out the importance of proper ventilation and visual checks.
>>
>> I would like to point out some terminology that may be confusing new
>> owners and/or Evinrude-Johnson differences.
>>
>> First, the Johnson-OMC single-lever remote control throttle-shifter has a
>> little red sliding lever which is used increase the idle speed for cold
>> starting. I believe this is what you are referring to as the "choke." It
>> doesn't actually choke or enrich the fuel the way a choke does. The V-4's
>> use a solenoid activated choke controlled from a dash-mounted switch,
>> while all the 4-stroke GM engines have either divorced (V8's) or integral
>> (automatic) chokes.
>>
>> The Evinrude push-button remote controls, do not have a separate "START"
>> idle adjustment level. Instead Evinrude (push-button) controls rely on
>> labeling the side of the unit with a position indicator for moving the
>> main throttle level to a "START" position.
>>
>> And you are correct, as he original OMC Boat owners manuals do describe
>> pumping the throttle to assist in cold starting, much like you would an
>> auto of that era. That manual throttle pumping of course assumes that
>> fuel
>> has reached the carb float bowls.
>>
>> At the beginning of a season, I always pre-start the engine at home
>> running on the hose adapter, before I get anywhere near the lake. As a
>> precaution I always turn the fuel petcock OFF, when I'm not in the boat.
>> When I arrive at the lake, and I'm in the launch line here's my
>> procedure:
>>
>> 1) Disconnect trailer lights from vehicle
>> 2) Remove storage cover
>> 3) Remove rear tie-downs and install drain plug
>> 4) Loosen bow-eye winch strap and remove bow-eye safety chain.
>> 5) Fold-back windshield and secure (Sportsman)
>> 6) Lift Motor Hatch and visually inspect for leaks or anything out of
>> the
>> ordinary
>> 7) Insure Battery terminals are tight
>> 8) Turn Fuel Petcock ON
>> 9) Check Engine Oil Level
>> 10) Turn ON Main Electrical "DISCONNECT" Switch
>> 11) Run Blower and confirm no fumes present
>> 12) Check Fuel gauge
>> 13) Turn Ignition key to ON
>> 14) Move Shifter into Forward and Reverse and Confirm Ammeter movement
>> 15) Turn over Starter Motor for no longer than 15 seconds, in neutral
>> 16) Pump throttle for 10-15 seconds
>> 17) Repeat steps 15 and 16 until first signs of firing. NEVER allow motor
>> to actually start out of water.
>> 18) Back boat down ramp and into water
>> 19) While still firmly on trailer, lower sterndrive gently, four or five
>> little pulses does the trick
>> 20) Run blower and double check under engine hatch (You might have
>> forgotten Step 3!)
>> 21) Set red START LEVER to REAR POSITION (Only on Johnson-OMC Single
>> lever)
>> 22) Pump Throttle two or three times
>> 23) Motor should start right up -- confirm idle speed is high (1500
>> RPM)(If you forgot step 19, shutdown and do it now!)
>> 24) Before backing off trailer, confirm sterndrive Tattle-tell is working
>> (located on Starboard pivot point)
>> 25) Continue warming up for at least 2-3 minutes
>> 26) Decrease idle speed below 1000 RPM
>> 27) Launch boat off trailer using little or no thrust from prop
>> 28) In colder weather (45 to 60F) it takes my boat about 15-20 min of
>> idling to reach 140 F (normal operating temp).
>> 29) Let engine idle at dock, while waiting for passengers. Recheck
>> blower,
>> cooling, and ammeter.
>> 30) Lower start lever Idle before engaging gear. "Taxi" well beyond the
>> "No Wake" buoys and apply throttle very gradually. I usually don't even
>> try to plane the boat (traffic and condition permitting) until I see
>> temps
>> approach NORMAL (135 - 140 F).
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: omc-boats-bounces@...
>> [mailto:omc-boats-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Andy Perakes
>> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 3:06 PM
>> To: Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's
>> Subject: Re: [OMC-Boats] 1ST RUN CHECKLIST
>>
>> The hopefully obvious 1st step before attempting a start is to inspect
>> the
>> engine compartment for any sight or smell of fuel. After you've done
>> that, run the blower for several minutes. I usually leave the engine
>> hatch open until it is idling nicely as an added precaution. My Reveler
>> has a lower engine access hatch that I usually remove too. You can do
>> this in the water, but I usually make the first start on the trailer with
>> the stern drive in a garbage can filled with water.
>>
>> As you probably know, the greatest challenge starting any carburated
>> vehicle that has been sitting a long time is to get the fuel flowing.
>> First I do a steady crank of about 5-6 seconds with the choke pulled up
>> and the drive in neutral. I still have the glass bowl on my fuel pump so
>> after cranking, I check to be sure it has filled and then I can guage if
>> the bowl on the carb has started filling too. After that and without
>> cranking the engine, I remove the flame arrestor and start pumping the
>> throttle (note you can do this at the engine via the quick-release cable
>> fitting which will release the entire throttle cable without affecting
>> its
>> adjustment near the carb).
>> Assuming you have the same Rochester carb, you'll eventually see the fuel
>> spraying from the 2 priming jets. Once I see the fuel spraying in, I
>> probably pump another 5-10 times, then put the cable back in place and
>> reinstall the flame arrestor. Then I start cranking again and will
>> usually get a turnover/start within another 5-10 seconds of cranking.
>> After it starts, I back off on the choke until I have a slightly fast
>> idle
>> (about 800-900 rpm on the tach) and I let it run until mildly warm
>> (constantly checking the water flow). From there I'm ready to hit the
>> launch ramp.
>> Sometimes it can take 30-40 seconds of cranking, but if you know you have
>> fuel spritzing at the jets when you pump the throttle, it will eventually
>> start (assuming nothing else is wrong). Its probably worth adding that I
>> still follow the owner's manual winterization procedure which consists of
>> dumping ~1 pint of 30W engine oil down the carb and stalling it out just
>> before fuel stavation. This causes a lot of smoke the first start and
>> can
>> lead to longer crank times, but I'm not going to argue with 42 years of
>> success doing it.
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "jd" <jdood@...>
>> To: "Evinrude & Johnson Boats of the 1960's and 70's"
>> <omc-boats@...>
>> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 4:01 PM
>> Subject: [OMC-Boats] 1ST RUN CHECKLIST
>>
>>
>>> .......no i don' have one, but would like one. I am mere days
>>> from
>>> launching and turning my key for the first time to see what happens.
>>> but totally nervous about it. so being that these are old boats,
>>> it would be nice to know what other people do before turning the key
>>> for
>>> the first time at the beginning of the season. a sort of check list
>>> in order of events. tap the fuel filter glass first? prime the carb
>>> with fuel first? change the plugs? I've had my boat out so few
>>> times,
>>> don't have much of a clue on the official OMC starting procedure, and
>>> often have started it after a mechanic or someone has already been
>>> messing with it a few days earlier. Had heard somewhere about
>>> pumping the shift lever forward a few times to prime the engine. But
>>> that could be totally wrong. So anyone want to take a stab at
>>> making
>>> a little checklist? I'll get it started with an easy one....
>>>
>>> 1) take boat to ramp
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OMC-Boats mailing list
>>> OMC-Boats@...
>>> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OMC-Boats mailing list
>> OMC-Boats@...
>> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>> _______________________________________________
>> OMC-Boats mailing list
>> OMC-Boats@...
>> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> OMC-Boats mailing list
> OMC-Boats@...
> http://lists.ultimate.com/mailman/listinfo/omc-boats
>
>
> End of OMC-Boats Digest, Vol 26, Issue 43
> *****************************************
Received on Monday, 15 June 2009